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Plato
Phaedrus Passage 240
Passage 14 of 53
Canonical reference 240
Ancient Greek
perseus-plato-phaedrus-grc
ΣΩ. σαφὲς δὴ τοῦτό γε παντὶ μέν, μάλιστα δὲ τῷ ἐραστῇ, ὅτι τῶν φιλτάτων τε καὶ εὐνουστάτων καὶ θειοτάτων κτημάτων ὀρφανὸν πρὸ παντὸς εὔξαιτʼ ἂν εἶναι τὸν ἐρώμενον· πατρὸς γὰρ καὶ μητρὸς καὶ συγγενῶν καὶ φίλων στέρεσθαι ἂν αὐτὸν δέξαιτο, διακωλυτὰς καὶ ἐπιτιμητὰς ἡγούμενος τῆς ἡδίστης πρὸς αὐτὸν ὁμιλίας. ἀλλὰ μὴν οὐσίαν γʼ ἔχοντα χρυσοῦ ἤ τινος ἄλλης κτήσεως οὔτε εὐάλωτον ὁμοίως οὔτε ἁλόντα εὐμεταχείριστον ἡγήσεται· ἐξ ὧν πᾶσα ἀνάγκη ἐραστὴν παιδικοῖς φθονεῖν μὲν οὐσίαν κεκτημένοις, ἀπολλυμένης δὲ χαίρειν. ἔτι τοίνυν ἄγαμον, ἄπαιδα, ἄοικον ὅτι πλεῖστον χρόνον παιδικὰ ἐραστὴς εὔξαιτʼ ἂν γενέσθαι, τὸ αὑτοῦ γλυκὺ ὡς πλεῖστον χρόνον καρποῦσθαι ἐπιθυμῶν. ἔστι μὲν δὴ καὶ ἄλλα κακά, ἀλλά τις δαίμων ἔμειξε τοῖς πλείστοις ἐν τῷ παραυτίκα ἡδονήν, οἷον κόλακι, δεινῷ θηρίῳ καὶ βλάβῃ μεγάλῃ, ὅμως ἐπέμειξεν ἡ φύσις ἡδονήν τινα οὐκ ἄμουσον, καί τις ἑταίραν ὡς βλαβερὸν ψέξειεν ἄν, καὶ ἄλλα πολλὰ τῶν τοιουτοτρόπων θρεμμάτων τε καὶ ἐπιτηδευμάτων, οἷς τό γε καθʼ ἡμέραν ἡδίστοισιν εἶναι ὑπάρχει· παιδικοῖς δὲ ἐραστὴς πρὸς τῷ βλαβερῷ καὶ εἰς τὸ συνημερεύειν πάντων ἀηδέστατον. ἥλικα γὰρ δὴ καὶ ὁ παλαιὸς λόγος τέρπειν τὸν ἥλικα - ἡ γὰρ οἶμαι χρόνου ἰσότης ἐπʼ ἴσας ἡδονὰς ἄγουσα διʼ ὁμοιότητα φιλίαν παρέχεται - ἀλλʼ ὅμως κόρον γε καὶ ἡ τούτων συνουσία ἔχει. καὶ μὴν τό γε ἀναγκαῖον αὖ βαρὺ παντὶ περὶ πᾶν λέγεται· ὃ δὴ πρὸς τῇ ἀνομοιότητι μάλιστα ἐραστὴς πρὸς παιδικὰ ἔχει. νεωτέρῳ γὰρ πρεσβύτερος συνὼν οὔθʼ ἡμέρας οὔτε νυκτὸς ἑκὼν ἀπολείπεται, ἀλλʼ ὑπʼ ἀνάγκης τε καὶ οἴστρου ἐλαύνεται, ὃς ἐκείνῳ μὲν ἡδονὰς ἀεὶ διδοὺς ἄγει, ὁρῶντι, ἀκούοντι, ἁπτομένῳ, καὶ πᾶσαν αἴσθησιν αἰσθανομένῳ τοῦ ἐρωμένου, ὥστε μεθʼ ἡδονῆς ἀραρότως αὐτῷ ὑπηρετεῖν· τῷ δὲ δὴ ἐρωμένῳ ποῖον παραμύθιον ἢ τίνας ἡδονὰς διδοὺς ποιήσει τὸν ἴσον χρόνον συνόντα μὴ οὐχὶ ἐπʼ ἔσχατον ἐλθεῖν ἀηδίας - ὁρῶντι μὲν ὄψιν πρεσβυτέραν καὶ οὐκ ἐν ὥρᾳ, ἑπομένων δὲ τῶν ἄλλων ταύτῃ, ἃ καὶ λόγῳ ἐστὶν ἀκούειν οὐκ ἐπιτερπές, μὴ ὅτι δὴ ἔργῳ ἀνάγκης ἀεὶ προσκειμένης μεταχειρίζεσθαι, φυλακάς τε δὴ καχυποτόπους φυλαττομένῳ διὰ παντὸς καὶ πρὸς ἅπαντας, ἀκαίρους τε ἐπαίνους καὶ ὑπερβάλλοντας ἀκούοντι, ὡς δʼ αὕτως ψόγους νήφοντος μὲν οὐκ ἀνεκτούς, εἰς δὲ μέθην ἰόντος πρὸς τῷ μὴ ἀνεκτῷ ἐπαισχεῖς, παρρησίᾳ κατακορεῖ καὶ ἀναπεπταμένῃ χρωμένου;
English
Benjamin Jowett · perseus-plato-phaedrus-en
Socrates. Now it is clear to everyone, and especially to the lover, that he would desire above all things to have his beloved bereft of the dearest and kindest and holiest possessions; for he would wish him to be deprived of father, mother, relatives and friends, thinking that they would hinder and censure his most sweet intercourse with him. But he will also think that one who has property in money or other possessions will be less easy to catch and when caught will be less manageable; wherefore the lover must necessarily begrudge his beloved the possession of property and rejoice at its loss. Moreover the lover would wish his beloved to be as long as possible unmarried, childless, and homeless, since he wishes to enjoy as long as possible what is pleasant to himself. Now there are also other evils, but God has mingled with most of them some temporary pleasure; so, for instance, a flatterer is a horrid creature and does great harm, yet Nature has combined with him a kind of pleasure that is not without charm, and one might find fault with a courtesan as an injurious thing, and there are many other such creatures and practices which are yet for the time being very pleasant; but a lover is not only harmful to his beloved but extremely disagreeable to live with as well. The old proverb says, birds of a feather flock together ; that is, I suppose, equality of age leads them to similar pleasures and through similarity begets friendship; and yet even they grow tired of each other’s society. Now compulsion of every kind is said to be oppressive to every one, and the lover not only is unlike his beloved, but he exercises the strongest compulsion. For he is old while his love is young, and he does not leave him day or night, if he can help it, but is driven by the sting of necessity, which urges him on, always giving him pleasure in seeing, hearing, touching, and by all his senses perceiving his beloved, so that he is glad to serve him constantly. But what consolation or what pleasure can he give the beloved? Must not this protracted intercourse bring him to the uttermost disgust, as he looks at the old, unlovely face, and other things to match, which it is not pleasant even to hear about, to say nothing of being constantly compelled to come into contact with them? And he is suspiciously guarded in all ways against everybody, and has to listen to untimely and exaggerated praises and to reproaches which are unendurable when the man is sober, and when he is in his cups and indulges in wearisome and unrestrained freedom of speech become not only unendurable but disgusting.
French AI-generated translation, non-official
Codex gpt-5.6-sol · Non-official working translation · 2026-09-11
Socrate. Il est maintenant clair pour tout le monde, et surtout pour l’amoureux, qu’il désirerait par-dessus tout voir son bien-aimé privé de ses possessions les plus chères, les plus bienveillantes et les plus sacrées. Car il souhaiterait qu’il fût privé de père, de mère, de parents et d’amis, les considérant comme des obstacles et des censeurs de ses très douces relations avec lui. Mais il pensera aussi que celui qui possède de l’argent ou d’autres biens sera moins facile à prendre et, une fois pris, moins docile. Il est donc nécessaire que l’amoureux jalouse les biens de son bien-aimé et se réjouisse de leur perte. De plus, l’amoureux souhaiterait que son bien-aimé demeure aussi longtemps que possible sans épouse, sans enfants et sans foyer, puisqu’il désire jouir aussi longtemps que possible de ce qui lui est agréable.
Il existe encore d’autres maux, mais le dieu a mêlé à la plupart d’entre eux quelque plaisir passager. Ainsi, par exemple, le flatteur est une créature horrible et très nuisible, mais la nature lui a associé une sorte de plaisir qui n’est pas sans charme. On pourrait blâmer la courtisane comme une chose nuisible, et il existe beaucoup d’autres créatures et pratiques de ce genre qui sont pourtant, pour le moment, fort agréables. Mais un amoureux n’est pas seulement nuisible à son bien-aimé : il est aussi extrêmement désagréable à vivre. Le vieux proverbe dit : « Qui se ressemble s’assemble. » C’est, je suppose, que l’égalité d’âge conduit à des plaisirs semblables et que la ressemblance engendre l’amitié ; pourtant, même ceux qui se ressemblent finissent par se lasser de leur compagnie mutuelle. Or toute contrainte, quelle qu’elle soit, passe pour pénible à chacun, et l’amoureux, non seulement ne ressemble pas à son bien-aimé, mais exerce encore sur lui la contrainte la plus forte. Car il est vieux, tandis que celui qu’il aime est jeune ; il ne le quitte ni jour ni nuit s’il peut l’éviter, mais se trouve poussé par l’aiguillon de la nécessité, qui le presse et lui procure sans cesse du plaisir lorsqu’il voit, entend ou touche son bien-aimé et le perçoit par tous ses sens, si bien qu’il est heureux de le servir constamment. Mais quelle consolation ou quel plaisir peut-il donner au bien-aimé ? Cette fréquentation prolongée ne doit-elle pas conduire celui-ci au dernier degré du dégoût, lorsqu’il regarde ce visage vieux et sans beauté, avec tout ce qui lui correspond, choses dont il est déplaisant même d’entendre parler, sans parler de la contrainte d’entrer constamment en contact avec elles ? Il est gardé avec méfiance, de toutes les manières et contre tout le monde ; il doit écouter des louanges intempestives et exagérées, ainsi que des reproches insupportables lorsque l’homme est sobre et qui, lorsqu’il a bu et s’abandonne à une franchise fatigante et effrénée, deviennent non seulement insupportables, mais répugnants.
Concepts in this passage
Care of the soul
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Desire
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Education
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Ether and field
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Family
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Freedom
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Friendship
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God
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Justice
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Logos of nature
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Love
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Nature
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Necessity
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Philosophical eros
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Philosophical training
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Pleasure
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Political equality
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Reason
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Rhetoric
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Roles and relationships
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Service
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Sin
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Time
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